I know, I know, it's an issue. I've been struggling with this for a while now, but what are you going to do, thorn in the flesh, you know?
What's that? You don't know the thorn in the flesh get out of jail free card? Are you sure you're a Christian? This is a little embarrassing. For you.
In 2 Corinthians 12:7-9 Paul writes:
"To keep me from becoming conceited because of these surpassingly great revelations, there was given me a thorn in my flesh, a messenger of Satan, to torment me. Three times I pleaded with the Lord to take it away from me. But he said to me, "My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness."
You don't have to be a biblical scholar to see what Paul was talking about. Clearly Paul had a struggle with lust. How do I know that? Did I interpret the Greek or the Hebrew? Did I read some sort of lost Aramaic translation that mentioned "nudey ladies?" Not exactly. I'm positive that Paul struggled with lust because that’s what I struggle with. That was a metaphor Paul wrote for me, which was kind of him.
So what I like to do when I mess up is to grumble for a minute and then shrug my shoulders and proclaim, "stupid thorn in the flesh!" Sometimes I kick a small pile of rocks in frustration only there’s not a small pile of rocks everywhere I go so I keep some in my pants pockets at all times just in case. I kick the rocks, frown, quote the verse and then move on without changing my actions or behavior or attitude.
Now I've heard people argue that Paul might have had a physical ailment. That the thorn in his flesh might have been epilepsy, or migraines or just a really pathetic vertical leap. Seriously, no ups. But I'm not so sure and to tell you the truth I don’t have any of those three issues. I mean you've seen me on the court, I'm like a white Mugsy Bogues.
Nah, I'm pretty sure it was lust that Paul struggled with. Unless you struggle with something else and then we're at a bit of a standstill. Because if you struggle with lying and I struggle with lust and we both want to claim "it's all good, it’s just a thorn in the flesh" status, we're in trouble.
We don't have a lot of options here either. Do you want to rock, paper, scissor for rights to the verse? Maybe we could pretend that Paul actually fell into a pricker bush and had 37 thorns in his side so that you, me and all our friends can avoid a bit of culpability? I'm open to suggestions. Really, I am.
p.s. Thanks for the fun idea Elizabeth
Of course if it was a struggle with lust, or whatever else, Paul would be the last person this side of Jesus to say it was okay to kick some rocks and give yourself a get-out-of-jail-free card. ("What shall we say, then? Shall we go on sinning so that grace may increase? By no means! We died to sin, how can we live in it any longer?"--Romans 6:1-3)
ReplyDeleteI've definitely had both sins and just plain uncomfortable things that I've asked God to wipe away and he seems to have answered that we're not going to do the Naaman cure (you know, a man of God comes out and waves his hand and everything's okay?).
We might not know what Paul meant by the thorn in the flesh, but we can know that the grace of God is sufficient for all ailments, physical and spiritual, and that his ultimate goal is to cure us of all of them. Maybe not until heaven, but that's not a good reason to sit down and stop trying, it's a terrific reason to keep pressing on past here.
This reminds me of the "Oh, well, we live in a fallen world" post. Good stuff.
ReplyDeleteAnd by the way, I did the survey.
Thorn in the flesh is a Hebrew way of describing the burden of another culture getting in the way of the Hebrew.Was very common and so Pauls thorn in the flesh was Gentiles, he was going to live with this "thorn in his flesh" and see Gods plan out. You can look this up and see it is very common in Hebrew.
ReplyDeleteI wasn't going to comment, but the word verification is "uncat" and I just can't resist that.
ReplyDeleteUncat can't haz cheeseburger.
Oh, I also did the survey.
I did the survey! And, ironically, I wrote about Paul's "thorn in the flesh" on my blog yesterday. It makes me feel better, too, but for different reasons...I guess that's the point of your post!
ReplyDeleteAnon,
ReplyDeleteIf you are going to go with the cultural issue then I think I would say that it would be more appropriate to state that it was the Jewish culture that was the thorn in Paul's flesh based on what he wrote. As far as looking it up, I have two books on 1st century near eastern culture and neither mention this particular euphemism. I know that the entirety of 1st century Jewish culture couldn't be contained in just two books though so I'll look it up. In my classes, though, this issue was specifically addressed by a professor I hold in high regard and he stated that there was a lot of debate on the issue listing several possible interpretations and the cultural route was not among those issues. If it was a well established fact I am pretty certain he would have mentioned it. It might help your veracity if you put a name with your claim and possibly cited sources instead of anonymously claiming whatever you feel like claiming.
As to the content of the post,
The get out of jail cards in the Bible are great. There are so many so we don't have to fight over them. You roll with that for lust and I'll take "all things are permissible" for wrath. It's cool, but remember this, I'm throwing down wrath so if you cross me I will destroy you. I'll feel bad for a little while but then shake the dust off with an "all things are permissible" and walk away. Also, don't remind me what the rest of the verse says, I'm a freakin powder keg right now.
I love pat excuses.... they make life so much easier!
ReplyDeleteAnd I did the survey!
Maybe he actually had an actual real life thorn in his foot that was embedded deep so he couldn't remove it? Or not.
ReplyDeleteI believe he struggled with chocolate.
ReplyDeleteHis great love and admiration for the treat that made him overindulge time and time again.
Yeah, they didn't call it chocolate back then, but I bet Nick could find a reference to this in one of those books. I know it's in there. Isn't it, Nick?
I did the survey
ReplyDeleteI did the survey! Thanks.
ReplyDeleteOh I've used that verse MANY times about more than one of my faults. And now I know how ridiculous that is. Dang it, now I'm going to have to find another get out of jail free card.
ReplyDeleteI got tired of my pants falling down because my pockets were full of rocks. So I got suspenders. But then I got teased.
ReplyDeleteSo I moved to an area of the country known for its abundance of small rock piles ripe for kicking.
That passage of scripture means a lot to me. The emphasis ought not be on what the thorn is or is not. The point of the passage (as Thursday pointed out) is that God's grace is sufficient.
I LOVE GRACE!
wv: councer
def: a 1st generation implement for removing thorns from feet (not sides)
A little known fact, prior to the foot-washing ceremony, a councer was used to pluck thorns from the feet of a weary traveler.
did the survey... the Jon Acuff signature would rock :)
ReplyDeleteThis is really funny, but of course since I struggle with lust too, I'm sure Paul had some sort of lust issue, you know? It just makes sense. And why pray that it be removed? Didn't work for Paul? He kind of already tried it, so I don't have to, right? And definitely don't have to work on my heart.
ReplyDeleteThanks for keeping us laughing, Jon!
ReplyDeleteI did the survey, and love what you do! Keep up the good work!
I did it
ReplyDeleteI did it!
ReplyDeleteWhat a wonderful post!
ReplyDeleteBTW, I did the survey!
i did the survey
ReplyDeleteI did the survey.
ReplyDeleteI did the survey. (I'm the one entry in the 60+ category that will skew your stats.)
ReplyDeleteI did ye olde survey.
ReplyDeleteHave a great day!
I did it! (The survey that is...and maybe the thorn in the flesh too)
ReplyDeleteI did it!!
ReplyDeletesurvey = done.
ReplyDeletei did the survey!
ReplyDeleteI did it!
ReplyDeleteKeep 'em coming Jon...
I did the survey
ReplyDeleteI did it. The survey, that is.
ReplyDeleteI did the survey :)
ReplyDeleteI did it.
ReplyDeleteBoth the survey and the using-the-thorn-in-the-flesh-verse-as-a-get-out-of-jail-free-card.
Word verification: parmanou - the Greekamaic word meaning "nudey ladies" in the verse.
I did it! And it was awesome :)
ReplyDeleteI did the survey!
ReplyDeleteI did the survey.
ReplyDeleteThanks for making us laugh--and think!
I know what you mean. It's kind of like the equivalent to something saying, "It is what it is." Are we really that defeated as Christians?
ReplyDeleteI've heard all kinds of things it could have been from being a homosexual to wanting to commit suicide. But whatever Paul struggled with, it's not like it's new under the sun nor does saying, "just a thorn in my flesh" justify sin.
Good blog. Now to go reminisce about old g/f's and wonder what marriage would be like with them. What? That's not wrong, it's just my thorn in my flesh, you don't understand.
I did the survey. Love your blog!
ReplyDelete@Nick the Geek - I'm with you.
ReplyDelete@Anon 4:16 - Hardly a convincing argument. That means Paul asked God to take away the Gentiles from him three times.
Thorns and thistles represent sin, check it out in the old and new testament.
I did the survey! and re-discovered that this is a great place to fellowship.. blessings from Puerto Rico :)
ReplyDeleteI did it! I am not letting myself read the blog yet though why you ask? It's my first day of grad school....I need some form of reward to get me through the day!
ReplyDeletei did it! i did it!
ReplyDeletei did it
ReplyDeleteI did it.
ReplyDeleteI did it.
ReplyDeleteSCL is the bomb. Love it just like it is. Ferreal.
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ReplyDeleteThis post really made me think. Thank you for sharing your thoughts.
ReplyDeleteOh, and I also did the survey.
"This is a little embarassing. For you." Hilarious.
ReplyDeleteI did it.
ReplyDeleteI d-d-did (wicky wick) the surrrrrveyyyy...
ReplyDeleteIf you couldn't tell I was trying to slow down the way you say "survey" by typing it out like that...I'm not too sure if it worked though. Oh well, I try my best when I "DJ text".
I did it!
ReplyDeleteI did the survey.
ReplyDelete-Summer
Did the survey :-)
ReplyDeleteDid the survey. Threw in a little yearbook style ending too.
ReplyDeleteI did it
ReplyDeleteI'd heard it suggested Paul's "thorn" was the Judaisers - the Jewish converts to Christianity who were trying to get everyone to follow the Law, and especially get Gentile converts circumcised. That always made sense to me.
ReplyDeleteBut that'd mean I can't just shrug my shoulders at my sin, so ... definitely lust. :)
WV, Unatined - A foreign object lodged in one's flesh that hasn't been dealt with. Paul had an unatined thorn in his flesh.
I did it. :)
ReplyDeleteJon - Lust? Really? I think we all know that the issue was anger - it must have been since that's what I struggle with. Now please stop messing with my get out of jail free card before I get angry with you.
ReplyDeleteOne of our deacons told a story that Paul's "thorn in the flesh" was his wife.
ReplyDeleteit was a funny story. rofl
I did it!
ReplyDeleteI did it.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeletethe thorn in his flesh must have been trying to get 3 small children to go to sleep-every night!
ReplyDeletedid the survey.
I think the irony of your title is that the use of "thorn in the flesh" is a get out of jail free card. In reality, the use of that excuse would put you in jail to that sin for a long time, haha.
ReplyDeleteJeremy said...
ReplyDelete"I'd heard it suggested Paul's "thorn" was the Judaisers - the Jewish converts to Christianity who were trying to get everyone to follow the Law, and especially get Gentile converts circumcised. That always made sense to me. But that'd mean I can't just shrug my shoulders at my sin, so ..."
But Jeremy, didn't you notice--this interpretation is even better. If the thorn in the flesh is other people, we can just blame all our troubles on them!
maybe we should try rock, paper, scissors, lizard, Spock...sorry couldn't help myself, I'm also a Sheldon fan.
ReplyDeleteAlso, I did the survey.
i did it too!
ReplyDeleteI've always found it interesting how Paul leaves the phrase purposefully ambiguous. There's a certain artistry in that.
ReplyDelete(Also, I did the survey!)
I did the survey. Thanks!
ReplyDeleteI did the survey...and I guess the Jon Acuff signature will work! :)
ReplyDeleteI did the survey
ReplyDeletei did it!!
ReplyDeletein case you aren't aware- your vertical is inversely proportionate to the number of rocks in your pocket.
ReplyDeletewv: fubject
def: a sure sign your child has altered his report card.
"You got an A in 5 'fubjects' this semester?"
Last night in my small group someone said "prayer is a good form of crowd control." I immediately thought of SCL. Have you written a post like that?
ReplyDeleteI just want to say thank you for not following the "normal" age brackets so I could still click the 25-31 group. I hate that I am clicking more and more 30-39.
ReplyDeleteI did it
ReplyDeleteDid the survey.
ReplyDeleteIn reference to your survey, I pulled a Nike, and "just did it"
ReplyDeleteWhatever it was that Paul was struggling with, he never "shrugged his shoulders and said, 'it's all good.'" No, he prayed fervently that the affliction be removed. But God kept it there as a way of letting Paul know the severity of sin. Only then could Paul appreciate God's amazing grace. Thus Paul's thorn was a means for him to draw nearer to God who can save us from any affliction.
ReplyDeletei did it. can't wait for the book to come out! :)
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteWell this just popped my bubble. Now what do I say when I'm doing something I know good and well I ought not do?
ReplyDeleteI did the survey =]
wv: unforke: what someone does when they call you out on your "thorn in the flessh sin" and then proceed to make you repent.
I filled out the survey. Great work, Jon!
ReplyDeleteI did it!
ReplyDeleteI did it
ReplyDeleteI did it.
ReplyDeleteChocolate chip cookies...
ReplyDeleteI did it
ReplyDeleteI did it!
ReplyDelete"i did it"....
ReplyDeleteI did it!
ReplyDeleteGood stuff today! Oh, and...
ReplyDeleteI did it!
I DID IT!
ReplyDelete:)
i did the survey :)
ReplyDeleteI did it.
ReplyDeleteI did it
ReplyDeleteI did it.
ReplyDeleteummmm
ReplyDeleteI did the survey
thx for making it short ;)
i did the survey!! can't wait to see the new site!
ReplyDeleteI did it.
ReplyDeleteThis is my favorite passage of the bible. It has helped me through some really tough times. God's power is made perfect in my weakness! How amazing is that?
ReplyDeleteIt always reminds me of the song "Frail" by Jars of Clay.
"If I was not so weak,
If I was not so cold,
If I was not so scared of being broken, growing old,
I would be frail."
did the survey
ReplyDeleteI did it (the survey). I don't know if this is where I was supposed to comment.
ReplyDeleteGreat post! And yeah. I did the survey. :)
ReplyDeleteI did it
ReplyDeleteGood lord, your blog gets a lot of comments...
ReplyDeleteI don't understand your point with this post. Maybe I'm arguing semantics here, but i think what you meant to say was "using the thorn in the flesh as an excuse". Get out of jail free card implies that there's a jail we're trying to get out of - the reality is that we're all in the jail and Christ has already paid the penalty for us to get out. A daily sin never needs or should be explained as needing a get out of jail free card.
I know you're a man that knows what he's talking about, but I think the problem with a sarcastic website like this is that people get the wrong idea about Christianity. The implication that we can do ANYTHING to get ourselves out of a life of sin is just wrong or counterscriptural, and I think that what you may have meant instead of "get out of jail free" was "excuse". The implication that we can jump in and out of "jail" with our sin (like in a Monopoly) game is just not correct and I don't want people to think that our freedom from sin works like that at all.
I did it!
ReplyDeletei did it
ReplyDeleteI did your survey! :)
ReplyDeletei did the survey!
ReplyDelete"I did it"
ReplyDeletejimichord@aol.com
I did it
ReplyDeleteI did it
ReplyDeleteI did it. Completed the survey, not used "Thorn in the flesh" verse as a get out of jail free card.
ReplyDeleteI did it.
ReplyDeleteWhat about someone who does not have a Bible conmmentary, or understand Greek, Hewbrew, or have knowledge of the culture as it was. Does it still count what this might mean to a Christian today?
ReplyDeleteWhen I was 15 years old I remember reading this, asking God to show me what this meant for my life and I realized that I needed to let go of the things that kept me from growing more in Him. Only I thought of a sliver and how irratating and distracting it can be if not taken out, and to think what thorn would feel like, stuck there causing all kinds of trouble in my life. For you, and perhaps for Paul it was lust. As the years unfold that thorn has been removed and others take up space only to be slowly removed once again.
I, too, did it! Today, I am a man...
ReplyDeleteI did it!
ReplyDeleteHow about Rick Warren's autograph :-)
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ReplyDelete"Ididit" the survey that is.
ReplyDeleteThat kind of looks like idiot, ha
Yikes, and look at my word verification: santic
I did it.
ReplyDeleteThis will be the 2nd question I ask Jesus when I see him face to face (although, really, I'll probably be one of those people who just slobbers a little and goes "duhhh") First question will be "what were you writing in the dirt???"
ReplyDeleteOh, and I did the survey!
wv = shorte. How did they know??
I did it!
ReplyDeleteI did the survey! Woo hoo!
ReplyDeleteI did the survey. I'm in GA also so I love when you comment on the local stuff, understand most don't but I think it's all the more funny.
ReplyDeleteI did it.
ReplyDeleteI filled out the survey!
ReplyDeleteI don't always reference this verse in my head when I have this attitude. I usually blame it on my being human and therefore its OK to be bad (somehow it makes sense).
just did the survey...
ReplyDeleteI've had a lot of theological training and never heard the cultural interpretation (re: anonymous quote). Re: lust interpretation: Jesus said "go your way and sin no more," so I do believe it's possible, with God's help, to rid ourselves of sins that involve our will and decision. I have known many people to overcome lust. Re: physical illness interpretation: I identify with this one. I have arthritis in my shoulders (in my 20s) and it gives me headaches, hurts my sleep, makes it harder to excercize, makes life harder. It's not going to go away barring a miracle from God, which I have prayed for. But I stay in the hope that God's strength is perfected in my weakness. - Clarita
ReplyDeleteI'll actually say something other than "did the survey!!" at this point...
ReplyDeleteI've always seen the "thorn in the flesh" verse as not a sin struggle, but some kind of disadvantage or constant unfair situation. A disability, for instance, or a disease that can make things miserable.
Recently, I've found so much inspiration in this verse because of a condition I've had, and it has powered me forward. There's PLENTY of other verses to help with some kind of struggle with sin, like lust.
Wow. I just used this excuse last week... I thought it was my own sneaky secret weapon against accountability for my actions...but glad I'm not the only one!
ReplyDeleteI'm certain "thorn in the flesh" went undefined in scripture so that all Christians can relate to a weakness that won't go away.
ReplyDeletePersonally, I'm thankful for the "thorn(s) in my flesh" that won't go away. It reminds me of my dependency on His unrelenting grace and helps to keep me seeking refuge in Him.
I did it.
ReplyDeleteBeen on holiday and have not caught up on all your posts yet. So no comment for this one.
You write great stuff, just found you after a friend posted your Kanye post. I'm looking forward to reading more of you...just wondering what's the survey everyone is commenting about? :-)
ReplyDeleteI knew a drummer in a praise band who got tinnitus and busted out this quote, which I felt was somewhat more appropriate.
ReplyDelete