(Nick the Geek is a guest post champ. In addition to knocking out his own blog, he occasionally jumps onto SCL to enlighten us with the kind of ideas that only a full time minister can elaborate on. Today he answers the age old question, “So what do pastors do all day?” Growing up as a pastor's kid myself, I often had friends ask me, "What does your dad do when it's not Sunday?" Nick has the answer. Enjoy.)
Wondering what your pastor does all day.
I want to start by thanking Jon for allowing me this opportunity. He is super frigintastical, insightful, and funny. I want to get that out of the way now so I don’t forget later.
As a minister I am always asked, “What do you do all week?” Sure people know about the church time things but it can’t take that long to make a sermon so what does the rest of the week look like? I am bound to get in trouble with the Alliance of Ministers Union (AMU) but what’s a fella to do? I’m tired of lying about my week.
I tell people about how much “time” the sermons take but no one believes it. Sure AMU gives us a scale that suggests we can claim 20+ hours a week for sermon preparation but people don’t buy it anymore with so many resources available online. Hey guys, they know we can just steal other sermons on Saturday night and be done with it, why would we spend hours praying and researching before ever writing down point one? It’s time to come clean.
I tell people about the meetings and building and event planning and relationship building and prayer and reading/studying but that doesn’t add up to the 60+ hours I claim to work each week so I have to tell people about the side projects and graphic work I do for the church as well. They keep asking me what I do all week and always seem surprised at how much work I say I’m doing. How can it take half a day to clean the Youth building after youth have been inside? They just don’t seem to believe me anymore.
So, it’s time to tell the truth.
On Monday morning we have a big party. All the ministers get together and we share stories so we can pretend “God gave us this message” because it is being shared all over the country. Then we make a big pile of money and roll in it because we are all ridiculously wealthy.
That takes up most of Monday so on Tuesday lots of ministers go play golf. I can’t because I have a knee problem so I won’t be able to tell you how that goes. I hang out with the Youth pastors and play Ultimate Frisbee instead. I have a Young Adult class that meets on Tuesday so I take a 5 minute break in the afternoon to write a few notes.
Wednesday is Youth day so I sleep in till about 4. Then I start playing video games and drinking Monster so I’m super energized for Youth service. I try to find some time to get online and download someone’s sermon so I can listen to it while playing Wii but if I run out of time that’s OK, I can always wing it.
Thursday I’m recovering from all the work I did on Wednesday. Seriously when you are used to taking it pretty chill the whole week, yelling for a few minutes can really take it out of you. Then I take my “day off” on Friday and do some house work on Saturday. If I have to do a Youth Sunday or anything then I skip the house work and download another sermon and listen to that while I play with my kids.
Well, AMU, the truth is out there. That’s what ministers are really doing during the week. It’s just like everyone suspected. People aren’t stupid enough to keep falling for the old lies. We need new ones that account for the internet. Not every church has a super successful blog but I think we can pretend to. Most church people aren’t that tech savvy. So AMU if it’s ok with you I’m going to start talking about the hours I spend on my blog reaching the lost online instead of trying to convince people that I actually go to band practice and help community groups like the Not On Tobacco class.
What do you say ministers, what do you do with your weeks? Afraid of the AMU? Leave an anonymous comment.
Everyone else, what are your suspicions about how your ministers really spend their weeks?
(For more great stuff from Nick the Geek, visit his blog My Experience as Youth Pastor)
Shenanigans! Ultimate Frisbee is WAAAYY harder on the knees (when played well, anyway) than golf.
ReplyDeleteAlso, I sometimes suspect that my pastor is running some sort of surveillance on me during the week. How else do you explain the constant use of sermon illustrations right out of MY LIFE?
Wow. The AMU is going to be looking to excommunicate somebody. With extreme prejudice. They don't take kindly to people blabbing thier secrets.
ReplyDeleteHere's my busy schedule:
ReplyDeleteMonday: Prayer day for recovery from a busy Sunday.
Tuesday: Massage in the morning and yoga in the evening.
Wednesday: Area Minister's meeting at the Super Deluxe Chinese Buffet. Spend most of the time afterwards talking until it is time to go home to wife for dinner.
Thursday: Tanning salon in the morning. Afternoon spent with family in order to leave room for Thursday night TV in our home theater.
Friday: Study day--do a Google search on Sunday's topic. Cut and paste some stories, points and jokes. Read the passage once through just to be sure. Friday afternoon--watching MTV in order to stay in touch with pop culture.
Saturdays usually includ something like paintball with the kids from church.
Then Sunday after noon (if there's no NFL) I take the rest the day off to have a Sabbath rest from a full week of work.
This is funny, but also sad because so many people would read this post and not realize that it was a joke!!!
ReplyDeleteMy husband once made a reference to working one day a week in his sermon. His frenemy approached him after the service and told him that he respected him for finally admitting what an easy job he had!!
I'm not a flaming anonymous. I'm an anonymous who loves scl and jon, but is also a pastor's wife.
We once went to a church where the pastor said (and he wasn't kidding, but was giving a "testimony" during Sun school) he loved his job because it was only two days a week. We left soon after that.
ReplyDeleteI know that my dad schedules his pastoral duties around his favorite morning radio talk program....
ReplyDeleteNick,
ReplyDeleteJust between you and me, do pastors ever get together to discuss who really gets on their nerves in the congregation? And what do you do about it?
Nick, you scallywag, you've sold us out!
ReplyDeleteJon,
ReplyDeleteSeriously thank you for letting me guest post. You are amazing and have an unbelievable ministry.
To everyone, please note that this is satire and sarcasm. On my blog today I posted a more serious take on the subject.
Jenl,
Shenanigans, that is a word I really should start using more often. I wold tell you about the pastoral surveillance but they are already watching me and I've said enough. Sorry that I can't say more. PS, it is the twist that kills my knee. I can avoid that in Ultimate.
Jeff,
I'm not sure if it is a good thing or not that I'm running a camp next week. Plenty of witnesses but it is kind of in the middle of nowhere. Hard to say, but if I see any golf balls I'm getting lost in the woods just to be safe.
Pastor Bob,
Doesn't that feel better? No more holding in the awful truth. Now resurrect one of your old sermons and take the rest of the day off.
Anon,
Rule number one, there is no fight club, rule number two you don't mention how easy your job is from the pulpit. Also, I love my frenemies. It may not happen right away but I usually laugh about the crazy things they say.
savinggrc,
ok all joking aside I hope the pastor was kidding around. Like anon right above you said her husband did. I don't know any pastors that don't struggle with keeping it to 6 days so they can actually have one day off.
Anon,
I do the same with the TV. Of course with DVR it makes it much easier.
Stacy,
Ok just between you and me, so no body else read this, we name names like no bodies business. That is part of making sure people think we all just happened to get the same message from God. When you walk into a new church and the pastor looks at you like he knows something, it is because he does. Now be a good girl and don't tell, if you do we'll have to just black list you.
Matt,
scalawag, another good word I should use more often. Just promise you will give me a head start if they send you. You owe me that much.
Word Verification: wanted
Um, I think the AMU has found me because that is really my word verification. I'm a bit creeped out right now. Pray for me people, pray for ...
If you had a fishing boat named "Visitation", then you could mention how much time you spend each week on visitation.
ReplyDeleteNick, I thought that golf would be easier than Ultimate Frisbee with your bad knees.
ReplyDeleteOh. I see Jenl said the same thing. My husband is a music minister and he gets the same questions (sometimes from me?!)
@Nick
ReplyDeleteThere's no way you can avoid twisting your knee in Ultimate. That's a game that requires a lot more fast, lateral motion on your feet. Maybe mini-golf would be best then? (I don't play real golf, so I wouldn't know.)
Something I've noticed both here and on your blog that I am curious about: why do you always capitalize "Youth?"
Fun post.
As a burned out pastor taking time off for recovery, I admit that I really struggle with people who think pastors don't do anything all week. I cried, worked and bled for our church people all week and it really hurt when people said I didn't do anything but preach. I know this is note is a downer after a satirically funny blog, but I just wish people would realize that pastors have feelings too and when they accuse their pastor of being lazy sometimes it really, really hurts. I'm living proof.
ReplyDeleteLove it! My dad is a pastor and seriously the busiest person I know. I LOVE being with him when he gets the "so what did you do all week" question. Because it usually comes from someone who's taken up a lot of his time that week.
ReplyDeletePastor Bob, you're awesome. I love your comment. Especially the tanning salon.
WV: eyesseb--I'm sure someone funnier than me could come up with a great way to tie this into the post.
Two words. You. Tube.
ReplyDeleteSure it always starts out looking for videos that fit into a sermon but who can resist the powers of a talking cat. Or the dancing down the aisle people. Or the rain choir.
I'm a ministry assistant and often get this questions cousin. "Why on earth do we need all those assistants on staff?"
ReplyDeleteI know every single one of us in my office works like a mad man all week and it gets on my nerves sometimes. I guess some folks think that the bulletin, e-newsletter, promotional banners, class listings, classroom signs, roll sheets, Sunday School materials, etc, etc, etc just magically appear!
@ wounded monk: I'm so sorry that the folks in your church didn't recognize your effort. It's so important for us to encourage our pastors, isn't it?
ReplyDeleteMy pastor works harder than 5 men, no you should probably make that 10. He's the spiritual leader, counselor, complaint department, financial guru, maintenance contractor, horse poop scooper (yes, our church is across the street from horse stalls and riders sometimes use our property as a shortcut!).... I have no idea how he even finds the time to put together meaningful sermons for the weekend, but he does.
I get this question all the time from kids and adults. I think it's funny that people think that a wed night talk, small group curriculum, sunday school curriculum, retreat planning, and general youth pastoral stuff can be done in a day.
ReplyDeleteAlso don't forget about staff meeting. It's 2 hours but it will suck 6 hours of life from you.
Now when people ask me. I just direct them here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8vUyObQxV_o
I have never been a paid pastor. But I did recently hear a woman complaining about how much the staff at her church was paid. Sure, they were paid a little more than the average pastor (who is almost destitute yet usually out gives most of the congregation...) but their salary did not include any benefits like health insurance, etc., which made it a pretty meager living indeed. Not to mention the staff at that particular church is AWESOME. I had to restrain myself from calling a worship eagle down from heaven to peck her eyes out in Christian love.
ReplyDeleteGreat post, Nick. The follow up needs to be written by your wife about what a stay-at-home mom does all day. Cuz I'm sure a lot of rest, relaxation, and bon-bon eating is involved...
Oh you show off. If you really did all of that fun stuff you would never have enough time for all the cool blog posts you do.
ReplyDelete<-SB><
I used to wonder the same thing, until I married a youth pastor. It seems like there's not enough days in the week to get everything done. Especially when you make relationships a priority, they take a long time to build and maintain.
ReplyDeleteI have a feeling that he may or may not shop online for cool graphic tee's or "dress shirts" that have random things sewn to it in odd places with words like "freedom" in some tattoo font and printed the same color of the shirt--so you can only really see what it says when he's in a certain light on the stage.
ReplyDeleteHe also twitters and blogs a lot. And I think his 13 year old daughter has nicer jeans than I do.
It's kind of weirding me out.
This is funny. I have really wondered about that a lot. My pastor takes a lot of vacations and keeps saying from the pulpit that when someone has a problem they should go to someone else in the church instead of him. I think he looks at pictures of himself all day.
ReplyDeleteJust kidding. While I know that pastors must be busier than I imagine, when my pastor says things like "Stop coming to me with your problems" I think he's passing some of his responsibility off onto other people. I'm sure he doesn't mean every problem, but if I ever had a really serious one, I still wouldn't go to him about it. And I think that's sad.
You mean I don't have to pray, mull over and meditate on Scripture and feel the weight about what I am about teach and preach in hopes of the hard words from God would have a chance to produce soft hearts by the power of the Holy Spirit.
ReplyDeleteMAN! All of that time with God for NOTHING!
*goes and practices hammer throws
@Anon @8:51a.m.
ReplyDeleteHow big is your church? Maybe your pastor is trying to send folks to other staff members because they are better gifted to help congregants with their counseling issues. A lot of time preaching pastors just suck at counseling.
(Or maybe he's being wildly inappropriate.)
@Beth @8:00 a.m.
Shame on any church that doesn't provide health insurance for its staff! I realize you weren't talking about your own church, but shame on that woman's church!
Our church used to only provide health insurance for pastors and senior staff... then a preschool teacher died of ovarian cancer because it wasn't treated until too late because she had no insurance. Shame on us at that time. ...Now everyone on staff has insurance.
I don't understand. I'm a pastor and as I read all of the satire, half-truths, and out-right lies in these comments - no one has yet displayed the courage and boldness to let the world really know what pastors do all-day and everyday: read Stuff Christians Like (and ping-pong, lots of ping-pong).
ReplyDeleteBack in the 90's when I was a missionary, this was my schedule:
ReplyDeleteMonday: Language study--Go around and say "wacka-shacka" (It means "hello") to at least 5 different natives.
Tuesday: Recover from the stress of learning a non-latin, non-germanic language by spending the day at the luxury tropical vacation resort, specifically, in their swimming pool (no pirhannas!)
Wednesday: Time spent only with natives! Sha is the man who cuts my hair and waxes my back; Rika is the young boy who fetches me fresh fruits from the jungle; Wisha is the young girl who gently places each morsel of fruity goodness between my lips; and Lipu is the sweetheart who gently fans me with a banana leaf.
Thursday: Adventure day! I go hunting with other chaps from town for endangered species only. (I can boast of having personally eaten 12 different endangered species.)
Friday: Hydroplane out of the jungle back to the city to get a way from the stresses of jungle life. There I see movies, eat at Italian restaurants, and sneak a sip of a few glasses of wine with the Embassy staff.
Saturday: Back to the grind in the jungle--I teach the natives how to speak English and play baseball (and sometimes hip hop dancing).
Sunday: Only by God's provision of grace do I have enough energy left over to ridicule their supersitious ways in my Sunday sermon. To wind down after the morning service I get a jungle massage by the third wife of our lead deacon. She gets a little lonely and all, being a third wife, so it's really a ministry to her.
But, the pressures of the mission field were just wearing down my spirit--and, I also feel like I accomplished what I intended to do in ministry--so I decided to go home and be a missionary to my unreached brothers in Indiana.
perkyguy,
ReplyDeleteDon't tell anyone but I named my motorcycle visitation.
Dawn,
It is the twisting motion not side to side. I can run and turn and everything but pivoting the wrong way will drop me to the ground. I haven't been able to figure out how to swing a golf club in a way that doesn't hurt.
Anon,
First part is the same as what I said to Dawn. Second part is that I try to cap it when used in a more "proper noun" sense like referring to the Youth group as a specific group but I try to leave it lowercase when I refer to youth in general. I'm not always good at it and sometimes capitalize when I shouldn't.
wounded monk,
Time for a serious moment. I'm really sorry for the pain you have endured. I know first hand how that can be. I hope you read my blog today too because it is a little more serious and encourages people to pray for their ministers. Also I sent you a message so, um yeah hope it helps.
Abbey G,
Yeah it seems that people who assume ministers don't work are responsible for all the extra work. The problem is they are often so oblivious that they don't know they are causing extra work.
Anon,
You Tube and Google have made sermon prep so much easier. Now if there was just a book that could tell us what God wants for the lives of all people. It might come in handy, but until then cat videos will have to suffice.
Anon,
Ok what is with all the Anonymous comments? People know I'm joking about the AMU right? There really isn't an alliance of gestapo like minister henchmen waiting to take me out for writing this is there? I was a little creeped out by my word verification earlier but now I'm getting worried. Also, I think assistants might work harder than the pastor. The bigger the church gets the more that needs doing and it is so easy to just pass along everything that you don't have time for and then come up with everything you want to see happen.
Beth,
I know this was written to Wounded Monk but right on. Just make sure your pastor hears you say that regularly.
Jon,
How did you know how much I despise meetings? OMGoogle I hate meetings and yet they are making more and more appearances on my schedule. I think hell is just going to be one long bored meeting (not a typo in my opinion).
Beth (the other one),
My solution to that issue is a giant foam bat. Big enough to actually hurt but soft enough that it doesn't maim or kill. Also, I should get my wife to write some stuff, but we have 4 kids so her writing looks more ADD than mine. "So I was thinking, don't touch that, that we should, leave your sister alone, go, I said don't touch that, to, the dog did what, get, oh forget it I'm not writing any more."
SB,
Why do you think I haven't been bloging as much now that summer is here? Ultimate Frisbee takes up my blogity time.
Sarah,
ReplyDeleteRelationships? What you guys don't just put on a bunch of events? How do you expect to make a life long impact if you don't just take everyone to the bowling alley once a month?
Anon,
Ok the anonymous comments are starting to scare me now. I feel like I can hear the music picking up in intensity every time I see the word "anonymous." If you ever figure out where your pastor is getting those clothes let me know. I can always use some new online shops to spend all that money I get paid. You can only roll in it so many times before it gets old.
Anon,
Ok I'm being serious now. I hope your pastor is just saying a good thing in an awkward way. It is good to train people to support each other. Some of my older youth are finally in a place, after 1.5 years of training from me, to start helping the younger youth. I don't want them to ever think they shouldn't come to me with their problems, but I am starting to listen to them and pray with them and then get them together with one of my student leaders to help them. This is a very good ministry model, but coldly saying "leave me alone" is not cool.
Joe,
What you spend hours a week with God to bring His words to the people? How crazy is that?
Anon,
Health insurance is spendy. We are having budget meetings and that is a big fat number so it is easy to try and touch it, but I'm encouraging that we leave a few things alone. I don't want to touch Missions giving or insurance. It would be better to cut pay than insurance because of the long term cost like the ovarian cancer situation you mentioned. Also, am I the only one hearing the Jaws music?
Adam,
Well of course I read SCL all day. It took a week to get through the backlog of posts the first time through. Almost as good as google and you tube when I need a quick sermon illustration. I need a ping pong table. That sounds like fun.
Pastor Bob,
See those are the mission stories that missionaries should share. Of course I understand why they don't. It can be rough raising a few hundred thousand to support you while working so hard. If everyone knew how much fun it was instead of the crazy stories about illnesses, witch doctors, warlords, and giant bugs then you would have to compete against way more missionaries trying for the same money.
Word Verification diegac
First I get the word "wanted" then there are a million anonymous comments now my word verification is telling me to die? Will someone please stop playing the same 2 cello notes over and over?
At my first worship/youth ministry job, I worked with an elder who was a business consultant. He made me do time sheets each week. They weren't too detailed, but I had to keep track of what I was working on each day. It was partly for me to review where most of my time was going, but also to protect me from that question - "What do you do all week?" Thinking back on some of those 50+ hour weeks reminds me how much I appreciate my 40-hour a week job now!
ReplyDeletePastoring was so easy that I had to have another job to keep me busy. We call that the super-spiritual sounding bi-vocational.
ReplyDeleteSome took that to mean I was not good enough at pastoring so I have another job just in case it doesn't work out for me.
I am convinced that God gave me 28 hour days to try and be a pastor too and even then I could not do the calling of a pastor justice.
God bless those who are called to pastor. If they make it look easy to you...God has especially gifted them.
You forgot to mention all your time on Twitter you can spend since you don't have a "real job".
ReplyDelete@Nick-he was serious and you could tell in his "ministry"
ReplyDeleteI work 40+ hours outside the church, plus all I can (20 or so) at the church, and I still have people who act absolutely shocked when I don't have time to their pet projects for them.
ReplyDeleteI am a recovering pastor's daughter and a full time ministry secretary. My boss, is the busiest person I know. He regularly works 70+ hour weeks. But yet, when people call the office and he is out of the office (usually for a meeting), the most popular question is: "Is Pastor Jon EVER in the office?" How am I supposed to answer that? Honestly, the answer would be: "No, he's at a meeting, trying to figure out how best to minister to your child/teenager? Now, how else may I help you today?"
ReplyDeleteI'm a ministry wife, and people ask me this all the time. I'll admit that it makes me so frustrated sometimes. Although, our staff guys do have a whiffle ball home run derby in the worship center at least 3 days per week. Seriously.
ReplyDeleteHehe, I liked this. "The Secret Life of A Pastor" is a secret no more!
ReplyDeleteThanks for the post, Nick. I'm going over to check out your blog.
kj,
ReplyDeleteI have heard of this requirement and to be honest I hate the idea of it. On the other hand I have thought to doing it for budgeting reasons. Taking my salary and putting it into multiple funds based on what I do through the week. It would drive the person that does our finances crazy though.
Larry,
I have known many "tent makers." Partly I want to do that, and in some lesser ways I do. I volunteer in many non church venues and have recently applied to be a substitute teacher. I feel that it is important to be outside the church, but there is also so much going on in the church so I'm torn to shreds over it all.
Marni,
Well of course there is the twitter. That didn't need to be mentioned like I didn't tell about all the time I spend breathing or going to the bathroom.
savinggrc,
Wow, to be honest that is kind of sad, but I know a few pastor like that. What is the old proverb, one bad apple spoils the bunch? A few ministers like that have many people thinking all are.
Alaska Stafford,
It is so hard to get everything done and it seems so few get the burden put on them. I pray for the day when we all share in the work.
Sarah Salter,
I wonder what people would do if you were completely honest like that? I wrote this some time ago but recently someone made a comment that I'm not in the office much anymore. During the summer I spend much more time out of the office because students are out of school. This person picked the wrong person to say it too though. The pastor's wife did give her a healthy dose of the truth. Oops.
Becca,
Hmmm, I might have to add a wiffle ball home run slam to my to do list each week. Sounds fun.
Charlotte,
Thanks, and I'm sorry/you're welcome.
Word Verification: randelv
It seems blogger might be on my side, it is telling me to run and delv into something. I am assuming a secret hiding place where the AMU will never find me.
If twitter is to be believed, my beloved pastors do a lot of running (literally) and drinking Starbucks.
ReplyDeleteI had to hide thier posts on facebook, I was getting jealous of their cush lives.
Jon and Nick,
ReplyDeleteAs assistant to the regional advisor of AMU, I'm going to have to ask that you cease and desist from these topics and remove this blog post. I will be contacting you directly after my weekly No Limit poker tourney, money bath, and trying to match Scripture to Charlie Bit My Finger for my Sunday message.
I'd ask you to make yourselves available for my call, but now that everyone knows you do absolutely nothing, I don't need to.
Micah
AMU, Assistant Regional Advisor
I think you left out the time to upload Itunes, and eat icecream while you are doing that. You pastors have all the time in the world and get paid so well for it. This was all true right?
ReplyDeleteI've been on staff at multiple churches and done a lot of ministry stuff at others. One of the pastors I worked for was incredibly busy but it was doing things like visiting people in the hospital, doing counseling and / or discipleship with people in the church, preparing his sermon for sunday, etc. He wasn't above vacuming the floor even etc. With him we were always encouraging him to go play.
ReplyDeleteI also worked for more than one pastor who would hide away in their office, extremely limit their contact with anyone in the church, delegate all the counseling / interpersonal stuff to underlings and spend a huge amount of time playing around with graphics on their computers, and as it turned out becoming addicted to internet porn. One of my pastors was meeting women on the internet and meeting them while they were off doing "ministry" meetings. Another one spent most of his time dreaming about growing a church of 1000 and meeting with his chosen few for "planning meetings" and golf. Then of course there were the leadership meetings / champagne brunch meetings after church on Sunday where everyone would end up toasted. I was talking to one of the pastors about pastor #1 above and his response, because he knew him too was... "oh he's a way better pastor than me, I would never do that, I would send someone." I know a lot of pastors who are busy with a bunch of religious busy work, that spend precious little time with God or the people. I do believe that a lot of senior pastors would benefit from some real accountability and a more ballanced life.
Please don't get me wrong. It's not sour grapes on my part. I do appreciate pastors who are faithful to their calling. I know how hard they do work. I'm just saddened by seeing a lot of gifted men I've known over the years burn out or fall away even under relentless pressure for them to be busy, but not necessarily in a good way, and for lack of accountability. I've seen men that I loved and supported and pray for get preoccupied with a bunch of different things that eventually destroyed their ministry. With them I would have loved to see them have men who would come along side them and work and play with them and confront them about their schedules.
Ok... back to the funny now. Sorry about that... I totally appreciated the humor in your post. This week has been hard watching the ministry carnage.
Thank you for this. I always wondered what it is I do all week.
ReplyDeleteHe forgot the hours spent each day on facebook, because that is how pastors find out if how much a person is growing in the spiritual life. +10 points if they post a bible verse as their status!
ReplyDeleteEllen,
ReplyDeleteI like to say "meeting" in place of anything fun. Everyone knows how much I hate meetings so they feel sorry for me. Of course, then I promise to say "monkey butt" during the meeting so ...
Micah,
Um, it wasn't me it was the other Nick the Geek. You can find him on twitter. He is in England or something.
elizabeth,
Of course this was totally true and not satire. I would never ... oh wait I am a youth pastor so ...
Raw Faith,
I'd say wow, but honestly I've met some lazy pastors. I figure there are lazy people in every profession. I don't think they start off that way, but after getting beat down they get cold and calloused. I tell myself that so I don't beat them about the head with a large foam bat and then shoot them with my t-shirt cannon.
dogearedpreacher,
And now you know, ... Didn't that movie come out today? I should go watch it.
Jeff,
Most of my kids are not on facebook. I do talke to them a lot on MySpace though. Infact I just got done chating wht one on the new MySpace IM.
Nick,
ReplyDeleteI told you so.
Wow, you're right. I really never do get tired of saying that...
Wow! An honest, forthcoming pastor? Get out of here! Next thing he will be saying is that from the law of Moses, tithing was never money! It was food in the form of crops and animals from the Holy land of Israel. Money could be substituted for the tithe at 20% above the value of the tithe. Lev 27:31. See theologian's website: www.tithing-russkelly.com
ReplyDeleteToo funny! A lot of people really don't understand the amount of time a pastor or priest puts into their work day. It's so much more than arranging a sermon or mass and then kicking back the rest of the time. Well, at least it shold be. Really enjoyed the read.
ReplyDeleteI have a feeling we all need to give grace to each other.
ReplyDeleteOne day, my minister was talking about prayer. He said that if he decides to dedicate an hour of his day to prayer and tells the secretary to hold his calls, we would think he's super spiritual. However, if we tried that at work our bosses may not be so understanding.
I went around with someone though, between Bible Study, youth group, I'm spending between 4-48 hours at church after my job. If the associate minister spends a couple of hours helping with the youth band his son is in, is that the church volunteer work we all do or something he's paid to do?
I'm not sure I have a good answer to that, but I have the feeling the answer isn't simple.
exegri - girls who've given up grrlpower. (Does anyone say grrlpower anymore?)
Since I live in a rural area, I know for a fact that my pastor is out hunting deer during the hunting season. He even brought us by some of an 8-pointer he took down one time. I don't eat venison, but the rest of my family said it was tasty. ^_^ Besides that, I know he also fishes and does other activities for the church, but other than that, I'm not too sure as to how he spends his weekly hours, except for the hours he spends on his sermon.
ReplyDeleteThough I truly enjoy the humor and sarcasm of this guest post, I also think that sometimes there is a good reason for a person to ask "what does he/she do all week?"......and a good reason for an answer to be given. Btdt, and not all pastors are working so hard - a fact which shocked me at first, and then,honestly, made me angry. Especially at a time when so many of us are working so hard to support our families. In *some* churches, there is a lot of buck-passing.
ReplyDeleteStill love this post, though. :)
LOL!
ReplyDeleteMy husband was a senior pastor of a church we planted for 6 years but we didn't take a paycheck because he worked full time also.
The hard part was that people would come into our business and expect him to be able to drop everything because they were having a bad day and needed to talk (of course these were the people who hadn't been to the church in three weeks because they had to spend time at the lake).
So he worked all day and then spent his evenings doing church stuff and preparing for Sundays.
People have no idea the work that goes into pastoring.
Sometimes I just wanted to scream- 'if you would just follow what was preached on Sunday (that he spent hours and hours preparing) and read your Bible for yourself...you wouldn't need to 'sit down us' and take more time away from our family.
But...that's just silly now isn't it?!
Wow-that came out bitter didn't it?! LOL.
I love the Lord with all my heart, but I do get a bit frustrated with His bride from time to time...working on that...
katdish,
ReplyDeleteWho is Tom anyway? You won't tell me that.
rob,
hmmmm, honest and forthcoming. Ok I'll run with that it sounds better than a lot of other things. I will say that the Tithe as it was is based on an entirely different system and situation. It should still be obeyed and I encourage looking at it as a starting point, but to say the tithe should be 12% if you are paying with money misses the purpose of what was going on. Of course if God convicts a person to that then they really need to keep to it.
Rachel,
Thanks, and yes there is a lot of work and so the leadership should be very busy, so it is really sad when we play around but expect the congregation to work their 40-60 hours a week then come in for another 10 volunteering in the church. I don't ask anyone to do something I won't.
Lauri,
Grace is one of the most important things we can express. I know as busy as I am I disappoint a bunch of people because I'm not busy in the right way. It makes me angry but I have to learn how to live grace with them. Also, I say grrlpower but I'm a hopelessly lame geek.
Carmen,
I know my senior pastor goes on hikes in the woods and fishing trips whenever he is well enough. We go together pretty often. These times are important for both of us. Sometimes it is even part of ministry because we can talk about church stuff, but mostly it is ministry just for us so we don't have to talk church. Hope that makes sense.
jujube,
I think questions are a great thing. If you don't have the answer then you should ask the question. I think sometimes ministers get bent out of shape about it because it gets asked so often. Maybe we should make a point of answering the question before it is asked by loosely detailing our weeks at annual business meetings or something.
Praise and Coffee,
It can be frustrating to have people, almost always the same people, monopolizing all your time because they refuse to help themselves. It is especially frustrating when those people are the first to complain that they aren't being fed. When you start to see them get it though it is worth the frustration. Just remember you are part of the Bride too.
I was once speaking with a congregant who, when learning the church actually HAD staff, was quite suprised...'Oh! I just sort of thought we all just turned up here on Sunday and that was it!'
ReplyDeleteI'm not kidding.
Of all the jobs I've had, none has been so utterly 24/7 every-aspect-of-who-I-am consuming and demanding as when I was on church staff.
It just seems like so many people in the church don't have a general acceptance that church staffers work hard. that's why the question gets so old.
when I was a teacher I never got the 'half-joking' questions about what I did all week, even though public school teachers are 'paid by the people' like pastors. there's a general assumption that teachers work hard. They're not expected to justify their hourly activities.
it just gets discouraging when you pour your life into something for a ridiculously small wage just because you believe in the cause and the call, and people look at you with suspicion that somehow you're on a cruisy gig, and don't know what it's like to work in the 'real world'...
In reality, all my 'real world' jobs, even coupled with extensive volunteering, haven't had the same unique type of pressure, workload and demand as church work, and have had A LOT better pay.
Even as a teacher;p
aahh, but still, I've gone back to church staff, knowing full well what I was getting into, cause you can't trade being smack in the middle of what god's calling you to for anything in the world!
Excellent, Nick!
ReplyDeleteSeriously, though, a pastor can be as busy--or unbusy--as he/she chooses to be. I've known many pastors who worked long hours, as well as pastors who didn't, by choice. And being not very busy is no sin or crime. The Sufi mystic Rumi praised the idea of laziness as a way of understanding God--the lazy mystic sits back and watches God at work in the world.
Our idea of a pastor needing to be busy all the time simply falls into the workaholic trap so many other Americans have fallen into--if you're not working 60 hours a week for the corporation, or for the Lord, then you ain't workin'.
Nick, that was great.
ReplyDeleteHaving been in the ministry (officially or unofficially) for 12+ years now, I have a good understanding of what really DOES go on. And I've seen everything from overworked folks to employees who truly do spend their days on youtube. (But as someone mentioned--the same thing happens in a secular office. I've been there too.)
I remember the day someone saw my husband outside of church and said, "You wear JEANS? JEANS?!?!?!?" And I was shocked that someone would think People In The Ministry were so very different from Someone In Just A Regular Job.
Nick,
ReplyDeleteIndividual responses to each comment? You're making Jon look bad.
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ReplyDeleteNick, the next time a frenemy brings into question the industriousness of pastors, remind him that Jesus spent the first three decades of His life just goofing off before even starting His ministry.
ReplyDeleteGreat post!! I tutored a priest in English once -- I know how long it takes to prepare a homily. Of course, he was doing it in a foreign language (but he did have a living dictionary - me). Because of the tutoring, I got to know how hard he worked. His English was important, but he could usually only make time for it after 9 or 10 at night (I, too, had some very short nights), and even then if there was someone who needed to confess or a sacrament or a special mass, we would not begin until 11:00. He was from Colombia, and I think people have more access to priests on call there than in the USA, but I got to see a lot of the things that eat up time, and if that time is not invested, then one has a less vested parish, as well. Needless to say, we have a very vested and bonded parish, and it begins with the priest (who works his heart out and fills his hours with labor for God).
ReplyDeleteI will fully admit that my days as a full time worship leader include flurrys of activity separated by facebook, fantasy baseball, random walking around, "researching" music, and reading.
ReplyDeleteI can't help it, I work extremely fast. I create loops for our services, update all of the chords, help plan services, practice, eat a dollar, go to production meetings, type words into ProPresenter, conquer France, prepare our click machine (to keep us in time), prepare our time machine (to travel through time), and do whatever else they ask of me, but I do all of that while facebooking at least an hour a day and updating my fantasy team enough to be 13-3 and second in the league.
Wow, my life as a foreign missionary sounds uncannily like that of Pastor Bob's! Of course, I'm in Mexico, so I can't forget drinking margaritas on the beach, going to futbol games & bullfights, and taking my daily siesta!
ReplyDeleteNick, I know I'm part of the bride, but sometimes that's so hard to see with this plank sticking out of my eye! :)
ReplyDeletePerkyguy,
ReplyDelete"Visitation"
that's Brilliant
we are a cynical bunch, eh! myself included. (something i'm working on) i once decided to keep a minute by minute log of my days. including the times where i've just sat down on the couch at 8:30 from a "normal day," only to receive an email, text, or phone call that immediately puts me back at work. even if just mentally. i'm still trying to figure out the whole boundaries thing with church members. i keep waiting for them to figure them out, but so far, no luck. i ended up stopping because it was feeding bitterness in my heart.
ReplyDeletehere's the thing... our vocation is probably the most abused and most misunderstood vocation i can think of. there are too many of us who really do keep lazy, undisciplined schedules, that encourage the "wow must be nice" mindset. but the reality is that if we are serving God by loving His people, caring for their needs, speaking truth, training leaders, making disciples who make other disciples, there aren't enough hours in the day. and sadly... even if you fall in the 2nd category, you will always get the jokes, judgment, and eye rolls. and you'll rarely get the affirmation and edification you need and deserve.
sometimes an email response can take an hour. sometimes building a relationship on facebook really is ministry. sometimes a golf game is the connecting point for the man who hates the Church. sometimes long lunches with pastors fuels us and restores us. sometimes sleeping late honors God because you are "poured out like a drink offering." i could go on and on.
for all of you who are weary, know that your reward isn't through the praise of man. but i do pray God sends you a few really great encouragers who can fill your mind and soul with the truth of the fruits of your labor. don't give up. it's not in vain. serve Him well every day. and don't let the nay-sayers get in your head. your God is FOR YOU.
I have a friend who, shortly after being called into the ministry, said to me, "I can't wait until I don't have to work." Well, that brother has since been blessed with a call to church planting, which we all know requires much work, as well as having to hold a secular job of some sort most of the time. I think his view of ministry has finally changed.
ReplyDelete