Ten years ago, if you drank coffee during the middle of a church service you were known as "that coffee guy" or "that tea lady." It's not that it was unheard of, but it certainly wasn't as popular as it is today. Now, forgetting your coffee cup before service is like leaving your Bible at home. While the rest of the people sitting near you enjoy Triple foam Hazelnut Creme Flavor Mocha Venti Explosions, you sit there like some sort of drinkless hobo. It's embarrassing.When I open up the SCL gift shop, which will have all 6 promise products, I'm going to sell a Bible with a hollowed out spine that you can put coffee in. There will be a little screw top spout at the top and anytime you need a sip you can just tip your Bible back. I'll call it, "the bean of God" or the "JAVA edition of the Bible" or "hot coffee hidden inside a Bible." The last one lacks pizazz but they can't all be winners.
But how did this happen? How did coffee mount such a successful assault on churches? I have a few ideas:
1. Caffeine is good.
Pastors realized that a well-caffeinated audience isn't necessarily a bad thing. The idea of having wide awake people in the crowd listening to what you are saying is pretty good.
2. Coffee cartel.
I can't prove this, but maybe a secret body of churches got together with Starbucks. They agreed to allow coffee in church as long as Starbucks stopped printing cups with those "the way I see it" statements on them. We hate those. Those deserve their own post.
3. Coffee became an accessory.
A lot of my friends don't drink coffee because they like it. They drink it because they like the idea of coffee. They like being associated with the Starbucks brand, which is kind of hip I guess. So it's like putting on a watch or wearing a certain pair of shoes. It says something about you.
4. Hand clapping.
Drinking coffee gives you the perfect excuse not to clap your hands. "Awww, I would love to clap awkwardly right now but as you can see, my hands are full. Shucks."
I'm sure there are a lot of other reasons why we're trying to make Juan Valdez the newest disciple, but those are the only ones I can think of right now. I haven't had enough coffee yet.
Update:
I just want to say that I love what the Dav suggested below: "Father, Son and Holy Roast." That killed me. I think this is going to be a fun topic.
96 comments:
This one is hilarious and just when I was wondering if you could think of anything new! When we moved about 7 years ago and started going to our new church I saw people with coffee in church and I couldn't believe it. I said I would never do that but now I probably bring in a cup 50% of the time.
i've never seen someone actually bring coffee into our church. we have signs that say "no food or drink inside the sanctuary" :-(
i didn't realize people did this. i think it's weird.
How about naming your Bible "The Scripture Sipper" or "The Caffiene Cannon". There should also be a zippered pocket for biscotti. And a bendy straw that's about 24 inches long so you can hold your Bible in your lap and read along while delivering frothy carmel half caff deliciousness straight to your pie hole. Ahhhhhhh.
Stacy -
See, this is why I say the comments readers post are usually funnier than the original post. Great ideas. Long live louisville.
Jon
Back in 01 I was working 12 hour overnight shifts on the weekends. I always took a great honkin' insulated mug of coffee to church with me. Otherwise I would have been hypnotized into a sleep coma during the "yes Lord, yes Lord, yes, yes, Lo-ord..." part of "Trading My Sorrows."
But I still caught flak from some people who thought that coffee somehow despoiled the Holy Place.
P.S. I think a cool name for a church coffee shop would be "Jehovah Java," but I don't think that'll fly by most board members...
Just trying to think up some names for your coffee Bible:
The Sip-tuagint? (New Testament only)
The Venti-teuch? (Genesis thru Deut.)
Would you then have to say that the Word is "God-brewed?"
Of course then you'd have to start referring to the "Father, Son, and Holy Roast."
You could start a new church! The "Joe-hovah's Witnesses!"
I'll stop now.
Jon, at a church in Cary NC, they have a coffee shop right outside the sanctuary... its a really neat idea I think!
we have gone a step further and have a mini coffee shop downstairs at our church in brighton. only in the evenings and there more for the guests that can watch the servic on the projector.
but it is a perfect thing for us doing the Visuals and sound at that back. been concentrating for an hour for worship and notices then 20 mins in to hearing someone talk you start to zone out. nothing like a nice coffee to keep you going to the end.
One of my pet peeves is when people come in late to the church service. (I mean, come on... it's 11 AM... you can't get it together by then on a weekend?)
But what really bugs me is when people come in late, but have a nice hot cup of Starbucks in their hand. The superjudgemental part of my soul immediately starts up with "Well, you'd be on time if you didn't have to be so trendy with your Starbucks, Mr. Coffee McCofferson."
Our church has coffee available pre-service, but there's something of an unspoken split between those who think it's ok and actually pretty cool to bring coffee into the sanctuary, and those who would never dream of it.
I think the leadership likes the idea of coffee'ed up audience and the social/relaxation element that the coffee adds prior to the service, but would prefer that it stay outside the sanctuary. But if so, then why put a couple of huge industrial sized pots of it right outside the doors?!? And there is no official policy one way or another on whether you can bring coffee in, so people generally just do as they "feel led" (i.e. they do whatever the heck they want).
I was once told that our assistant pastor really gets bothered by people who bring coffee into the sanctuary as he's one of those who feels like it is irreverent and encourages people to take church and God less seriously. I kind of flinched when I heard that because we usually sit in the pew right behind him (the pew he sits in when he's not on stage), me with my steaming, good-smelling cup of coffee probably wafting coffee steam right to his nostrils and causing him to think angry thoughts against sanctuary-disrespecting coffee drinkers.
Do people actually drink coffee in church now? That's socially acceptable? Wow.
I'm pretty sure you'd get excommunicated if you brought coffee to Mass... You crazy Protestants, you.
I attend the Evanston Vineyard, and they had a 'no drinks' policy in the auditorium for a while (new building, new carpet). Then they installed these cup holders on the back of the chairs, which seemed to say 'its OK now' but they didn't announce anything, so I still had these feelings of guilt (overwhelmed by my 'its-a-9am-service!' justification). But the cherry on the top was the Easter service, where they had a special 'moment' when all the lights went off as soon as I put my coffee into a broken cup-holder. I was frantically fighting up a puddle, with two napkins, in the 5 minutes of a dark candle-delivery cum cross-highlight show hoping noone would ever see...
One thing I know, that new carpet is really absorbent.
At the church where I grew up, bringing coffee in the auditorium would have been a scandal worth a sermon, a committee, a bible-class mini-series, and some serious repentance. Thus, now the furthest I'm willing to go is styrofoam cup coffee from the church kitchen, and only if I think I can finish it by the end of the welcome/announcements.
HA! Our church got too big and opened an Annex video campus WITH a coffee shop in the sanctuary! Now, we never go to main campus because it is BYOC (bring your own coffee for all you peeps who have been saved since age 2 and are not familiar with the sweaty Philistine acronym BYOB). We even offer a free cup to visitors (otherwise a dollar love offering is accepted). Coffee in church! That's what I'm talkin bout baby.
God and Coffee.
The two things I can. not. live. without.
Combining the two on Sunday morning?
*perfection*
I don't drink coffee, but am addicted to Diet Mountain Dew. Nothing starts the day of better than the 24 oz. bottle. I kind quit attending church while in college but towards then end started going to a church where everyone had their starbuck's cup and so I brought my Mountain Dew bottle with me. I eventually went back home and went to church with my parents. My mom looked at me like I had walked into church naked when she realized that I had a diet mountain dew in the service with me.
I went in a Christian Book Store and their coffee shop was called "Holy Grounds." My Bible study teacher complained to them and said coffee is not holy. God is holy. ;>)
We are SO in to this, BUT ONLY in our "contemporary" service... which may be another good topic for you "contemporaty, traditional and the Blended" service. OH there is so much to say on that topic.
i'm with lana. for our "contemporary" service, i'll bring in coffee, diet coke, and maybe even a cookie (gasp!). but never would i ever at the "traditional" service.
speaking of traditional, blended, and contemporary, there is a church in our town that takes the coffee/God connection to a new place and advertises their contemporary service as "caffeinated" and their traditional service as "regular." don't they realize that "caffeinated" actually is in fact "regular" in the coffee world?
We are all about the Coffee at Rolling Hills. My wife is on the Environment(Green) Team and they are even replacing the coffee at the coffee table with Fair Trade coffee!
The other nice thing is that we meet at a movie theater so we have nice cup holders already built in.
I am thinking that once we build out our own place in the next year or so that it will be built with the ability to have drinks in the auditorium.
Coffee = Liquid Anointing!!!
The pastoral staff at my last church would all stumble into the sanctuary for pre-service prayer...each of us with a steaming mug of coffee in our hands. The board members tried to stop us, but we just gave them our scary, "we work two jobs each besides ministering in this tiny church and by the time Sunday morning rolls around, we are tired, so BACK OFF!!!!" looks, and they eventually gave up.
In my current church, our sanctuary is also used for church dinners and other special events, so drinking coffee in church really isn't much of a stretch.
Sad, though...I'm the ONLY coffee drinker on this staff...man, I miss those Sunday morning fights for the last drop and racing to make a new pot before some deacon's wife got to it first and made DECAF!!!!
I call coffee the "Christian cigarette".
I know pastors who call coffee "Liquid faith". Indeed.
We are not supposed to have drinks or food in the sanctuary either, but I often sneek in a coffee from our adjacent cafe. It helps me, what can I say? And, I am not the only one sneekin it in...
As far as the combination of caffeine and God, it needs to be pointed out that monks were a huge part in bringing coffee to the forefront of European culture. They found that when they ate the fruit or drank the mixture of the fruit and water that they were able to pray much longer without falling asleep.
Man, I am so glad that we have the perfected form of coffee that we do today.
lol who'd a thunk drinking coffee in church would have brought out the masses. The church that I'm checking out right now, has an espresso bar in the back corner of the sanctuary. While it only serves regular drip coffee on sunday mornings (pre-service, greeting time, and post service), they bust out the froufrou drinks (FOR FREE!!) For the young adult group on fridays. It's a beautiful thing.
I thoroughly enjoy a good cup of coffee, but having in the church service? I dunno 'bout that. I mean, don't we all need to time to pop a breath mint or piece of gum before we start singing? Otherwise - ew! Coffee breath galore! Let's keep the java in the gym, shall we? Thanks. ;)
Not only do we have a small coffee bar at church (My wife and I help serve coffee on Saturdays), but the Pastor, Worship Team, and just about everyone I see is downing the last of the Starbucks they brought in while in line to get...MORE COFFEE.
When I was a kid, we used to get dirty looks from people about eating life savers we found in my mom's purse.
I just wanted to give kudos to JenL. I'm totally with you, hon.
It took some adjusting to get used to this coffee in the auditorium thing at my church. I now fully embrace it, but we are hardcore Dunkin' Donuts folks in my crew.
Two comments.
First, doesn't any else's church only have decaf coffee? I mean, when I first started going to church and saw that only decaf was served, I was puzzled. Then it seemed like most people only had decaf at small group meetings. It was like the "beer dance" when you wonder if you're less holy than those who can do without that jolt of caffeine.
Second, I was watching House one evening with my wife (I'm probably going to Hell for watching House) and everyone in the show was carrying cups of coffee with the typical lids (you know, Starbucks paper cups). She said something like, "So it's come to this. Adult tippy-cups".
I thought it was hilarious!
You folks should attend an emerging church. At our old church, we not only had a coffee bar, we had flavored teas and "Death by Lemonade" along with cookies, donuts, coffee cake and banana bread. It was a buffet for the body AND soul ;)
lovin' me some coffee.....but we're SUPPOSED to drink it in the "coffee room", classrooms or halls......and by the time i would get to the worship center it was cold anyway....
we also have hot chocolate and GREEN TEA available too.......sigh......
I used to attend a young-adult oriented, alternative service on Wednesday nights at my church and always had my Sonic Cranberry Limeaid with me. One time we had to meet in the main sanctuary where drinks are not allowed and man, I'm telling you, it was an adjustment. I just want to worship God with my Limeaid please! Unfortunately, for reasons I've yet to figure out, the church decision makers disbanded our ultra cool church. I sure do miss it, I just can't get into the stuffy 'old people' service I'm supposed to go to now.
Our church is building a cafe in our new building. I'm excited, because I'm not a big Starbucks fan - unlike many people at my church. I'm all about the independent, small coffee shop. It's a carry over from my days as a open liberal - also unlike many people at my church. But I digress ... We can't drink coffee in our sanctuary anyway, even though we serve coffee pre-service. But that's kind of good for me, because I don't feel like people giving me that "he's a hippie" stare when they see my no name cup.
I really tried hard to top "Father, Son, Holy Roast," but I can't. That was good.
forgot to add to my previous post, this church also has a Jehovah Java for a while.
Why'd they take the coolness away?
You can get coffee mugs from The Old Lutheran website with "This is most certainly brew" on them. You only get it if you're Lutheran or have been through Lutheran confirmation but it's quite funny any way. At my church, we go through approximately 6 gallons of coffee every Sunday.
It does really seem like the Protestant Church (of which I am a part. No judging here) has some sort of endorsement deal with Starbucks. It is crazy. We say addiction is wrong but we ignore that most of our pastors, deacons, parents, even a lot of our youth are addicted to coffee - how else can you describe not being able to get up in the morning without it, being crabby until you have it, drinking it constantly? The main think I want to know is how can we justify paying that much for it?
Most Christians don't tithe. Some have issue with the concept itself, but a lot just say that they can't afford it. Yet they can afford $20-$50 each week brand-chain coffee. I am a missionary and have to raise a budget off of what people are willing to give to missions. I can safely say that, because of decisions like that, because people value small luxuries like coffee (and I don't have anything against coffee, just coffee addiction and super-expensive coffee from chains) more than they value financial responsibility, the tithe, and missions giving, I have been living on $400 each month for the past two years.
I remember I was once at a conference where there was question & answer time with a decently prominent Pentecostal theologian. The question came up, "What about coffee addiction." His answer was simply this: He hefted his Starbucks and said, "Well, if it's wrong, I don't want to know about it." A lot of us were angry that he had brushed off such a serious question. Addiction is wrong, whether it's coffee, video games, sports, working out, TV, what have you - addiction is addiction and addiction is wrong.
Sorry to have such a long post. This isn't really much of a sensitive topic for me, it's more that I think the Church (as a whole) has turned a blind eye to this and it's something that NEEDS to be addressed. And as I said, it's not that I have something against coffee; I enjoy a good cup of coffee now and then. It's valuing coffee higher than responsible finances and the work of God that I have an issue with.
Coffee in church? Oh, we go WAY beyond that in my church. We have a fabulous continental breakfast every Sunday - and it's complimentary! There's not even a jar for "donations".
The food table opens up about 1/2 hour before the service starts, and then reopens right after the service ends. Of course there's coffee, but also juice, milk, chocolate milk, and a varietly of soft drinks, regular and diet. Then there's the food - muffins, donuts, and cookies (the good stuff from the bakery, not Chips Ahoy or Oreos). There's also fresh fruit - grapes, strawberries, pineapple. We also have cute little squares of sliced cheeses (cheddar, swiss, you name it). There's probably some fresh veggies too, but I don't pay much attention to those :)
If there is a special occasion (or even if there's not), the ladies who "do the food" (all volunteers, by the way), will add something extra, like sausage and homemade biscuits and gravy and home fries. It's better than a Shoney's buffet!
Right now our church is portable, meeting in a school, so our ladies just set everything up in the lobby/hallway just outside the gym. Being a school, it's easy to clean up after ourselves, so spills are no worry. We are in the process of building our own building, and the first thing everyone wanted to know was, are we going to give the ladies a good commercial-type kitchen so they can continue to serve the Lord as He has gifted them? The answer was easy - YES! Will we have rules like "no food on the new carpet" - of course not! Although we will take care of this new building God is providing, we will not be a slave to it, nor will a little spill on the carpet ever be more important than making people feel welcome.
We are definitely not your grandmother's church!
The weirdest thing, even above and beyond allowing coffee in the church sanctuary, is having an entire CAFE' or coffee shop in the church! Crazy. Welcome to the 21st century, people! Next, they'll be allowing alcohol in church! That brings about a whole new idea of church...
The coffee-during-services trend hasn't made it to my church yet, so if you do start selling the bean of God, I'll be first in line!
My, my! Who knew coffee would arouse such interesting conversation? We drink coffee in church and have the numerous stains on the carpet to prove it! I'm not a big fan of Starbucks. Mostly because I have a hard time justifying that much money for a cup of coffee. This has been by far the most thought provoking "comments" section to date. "Mr. Coffee McCofferson?" -- Hilarious! And I appreciate what Jesse had to say about Christians who don't tithe but can afford to put down $20 or more a week on coffee. My understanding is that you give God the tithe first. If that's the case, then it's the coffee that they shouldn't be able to afford. Most of the missionaries I know basically live in poverty. They do what they do because they've been called. How insulting it must be to God that we are so wasteful with what He provides while others suffer. I'm not gonna get off on a tithing lecture here, BUT BOY COULD I!!!!
#4 "Hand Clapping" applies to my husband. He can't enter church without first going to get his cup of coffee. Subconsciously I knew it had to be about the hand clapping. Now you confirmed it. Ah ha. - GREAT POST!
Hey Daphne... I go to HPC too, but I attend STA campus and we have the coffee pots set up in the hallway and for the Spanish service at flow time everyone goes and gets their cup of coffee. Loving the coffee flow in the sanctuary after being at church from 7am till 1:30 and 3 services in two different languages... yeah coffee is needed.
I've got an idea for a post. How about, "Leaving the violent stories out of the Children's Bible"? Stuff like Judah has sex with with step-daughter, Ehud stabs the king in Judges, and David castrating the Philistines in 1 Samuel 18:25-27.
Part of the reason I don't drink coffee (other than it being icky) is because man, people go mental and get MEAN if it's not there. People would probably get more angry about lack o'coffee than if you kicked their grandma in the face or something.
I love this post. I have said for many years that Caffeine is the Christian's drug of choice and Coffee, the number one delivery mechanism. I have visited churches all over the world and it IS rare but not unheard of, especially in the new modern, we gotta please everyone church,(see Me Church on Sermon Spice) to see coffee in "the Service". I really enjoy your insights, I love when we can laugh at ourselves. Honestly, we are a comical lot aren't we? I don't like coffee though, can I bring in my Diet Mt. Dew?
I think the last anon commenter goes to my church! LOL
We have the same thing, donuts, fruit, juice, yogurt, and of course coffee (and mints for afterwards). And we are meeting in a school gym while our building is under construction.
Our service starts with Praise and Worship, then annoucements. After annoucements we have fellowship time and that is usually when I get my coffee. I like to have my hands free during worship. After fellowship, the sermon starts and I can sit down with my fresh coffee and enjoy the message.
I think alot of people are reading too much into bringing coffee into the sanctuary. I mean, if you can go to church with jeans on (GASP) why can't you take coffee in church? What's the big deal? I think having things like that makes people feel more at home and less intimidated especially if they are visiting. There is something about food (and coffee) that make people feel at home.
Sorry, I didn't mean to post such a long comment.
This is CRAZY! I've felt guilty about sneaking in my water bottle that I hide under the pew. But I can't help it, since I nurse my baby during church, I need to be well-hydrated!
I sometimes get eyes rolled at me for nursing my baby in church. I dare any of those eye-rollers to bring in a cup of joe to 'big church.' That would totally be calling the coffee kettle black!
I've heard of church services that have taken place in bars during business hours. must be so awkward.
At any rate, caffeine will bring pew-fidgeting to an entirely new level.
Coffee sure has a culture of it's own, doesn't it?
My college held a multidisciplinary seminar class about it last year: professors from biology, chemistry, psychology, economics and sociology came together to teach it. wish I could have been there.
Personally, I hate coffee, so I am doomed to a life of drinkless hobo-hood. (Although sometimes I carry in a cup of water to try to convince myself I'm even a quarter as cool as the coffee drinkers.)
At a church I once attended, bringing coffee to church was for the "weak" - real men brought McDonald's breakfast sandwiches or double cheeseburgers.
I kid you not. As if it's not hard enough keeping your focus on Jesus, imagine sitting next to the breakfast-scarfer for an hour as the Holy Spirit and the Egg McMuffin are fighting for control of your senses.
As for coffee, when I don't bring it, I feel like I don't know what to do with my hands - do I put them on the back of the pew in front of me? Do I put them in my pockets? Better to have the coffee.
this is fantastic. i love #4.
That coffee-Bible idea is straying dangerously close to my flask-Bible idea. Careful with the copyright infringements...
I kid, of course, that's just where my mind went with your idea.
and aren't you even going to point out that the readers of scl should join my coffee blog...?
www.seeyouatcoffee.ning.com
we extoll the greatness of SCL in discussions around the table every morning, and then when we meet at the starbucks venue that IS INSIDE OF OUR CHURCH!!!!! we know a thing or two about caffiene in big d!
you continue to astound me with your creativity
I pastor a small choice that feeds my addiction to coffee by buying me a coffee card. So it makes me feel like I have an OBLIGATION to bring my cup, and show them that my appreciation.
However, I do struggle with the Starbux thing. So many small coffee shops have gone out of business because they've come to the neighborhood. Plus, they don't necessarily pay fair wages to their coffee growers, and even though they could, don't encourage much of the organic coffee.
We brew at church, too. Only fair trade organic coffee. And it's good. The cup I brought in gets refilled. My cup runneth over.
Haha, in the Mormon church it would be Sprite. Caffeine-free soft drinks FTW! XD Although basically the only liquid people bring into the sanctuary is juice for their kids.
I am guessing that hardly anyone would read this post would be as old/Lutheran/Scandavian as I am to know about egg coffee. A great tradition of coffee served in Lutheran Church basements. Here is a link to a recipe:
http://www.oldlutheran.com/kitchen/beverages/nec.shtml
There is a bit of division about the whole with shell/without shell issue.
Now, this is only made rarely for special ocassions. I suspect sometimes people aren't even told.
Our night service has taken the coffee/church combination to a whole new level. The night begins with supper outside and a big lineup at the coffee/tea kiosk. Then, armed with our steaming mugs, we all proceed inside to our seats around little round tables (complete with tablecloths) - that's right, they've done away with the traditional pew setup to enable people easier coffee/snack management. No need to worry about balancing your Bible, bulletin and hot cup of coffee while you're crammed into a tiny row of seats! Take a table, spread your crap out.
After the service, the volunteers come around to all the tables with the leftover supper and try to force it on people.
This service is known as 'Late Church'. My campaign to get the name changed to 'Latte Church' has so far been unsucessful. (And by campaign, I mean announcing the idea loudly to nobody in particular every four weeks or so.)
The Dav, please don't forget that this gives "He-Brews" an entirely different meaning.
Thanks. I'm here all week
do people actually hold their coffee in their hand and drink it *while* standing for worship? that's odd. i do have an occasional cup during church - i'm a college student, 10am is early!! - but i only drink it while everyone is seated for announcements and the sermon. and i allow a little time - or maybe a cup of water - before and after Communion to cleanse my palate. :)
We went to a church that sold coffee from their cart called, "HeBrews". Crazy.
The Holly Fawder likes coffee, but prefers communion. The buzz is more substantial.
Wow, you Protestants are wacky.
I have a college classmate who is now in Texas at church with a coffee bar (although I wonder if they call it a bar or a shop? That may be taking things too far). As an usher who greets folks and makes them feel welcome, he calls himself the Minister of Java.
And Jehovah Java is indeed a Christian coffeehouse in Missouri :-)
Oh oh. I'm one of those "bring in my coffee" kind of gals. HOWEVER, I set my cup down during the singing so that I'll have my hands free for the clapping thing... not that we do that a whole lot in the CofC.
But hey, we're getting trendy! Our church actually played a song with instruments! Either we're broadening our view or else we're going straight to hell. It depends on who you ask...
Kamina-if there is a petition for "Latte Church" sign me up. I think that's hilarious and appropriate.
I think starbucks needs to get in on the action. There's one on every street corner, so why not in every sanctuary?
But, ahh, the spiritual clarity that comes with a french press.
It's weird reading the comments of the people who say they've NEVER seen coffee in church before. We not only have coffee drinkers in our church, but we have our own coffee barista upstairs that at coffee break you can go and order yourself a latte and it will be delivered right to you during the service. Our church is called "The Gate" and the coffee bar is called "Water Gate"...but I liked the suggestion of calling it "Jehova's Java"
We have cup holders in every seat at our church. That way you have somewhere to put your coffee when it comes time to clap. We also have a coffee shop in the lobby that is busier than the local Tim Horton's on a Sunday morning.
Mike
Saskatoon, Canada
Mike from Saskatoon... kudos for the Timmies nod. That is my favorite coffee hands down. We definitely need more franchises here in the US.
Heck, in our church, it is socially acceptable to get up in the middle of the SERMON, and get a refill from the gi-normous coffee urns, which are located off to the side. And then after church come the half-doughnuts!
John... Don't make me bring up "Bob and the Donut". Anyway, don't you think the coffee we provide is kinda Folgers truck stop coffee? Nasty. We need a coffee cart or something with real baristas, at least someone who can grind and make coffee according to current societal expectations (LOL!).
I recently heard a new heresy, Donutism (no, not Donatism). DonAtism states that the a sacrament is only as effective as the morality of the priest administering it.
DonUtism states that a modern, progressive church is only as effective and relevant as the quality of its coffee and donuts in the foyer, and thus affects the Christian consumer's choice in Church.
PJ,
Thank you so much for #3. I can't stand coffee or even the wine cooler of coffee -- cappuccino!. Why in the world would I pay $5 to look cool by forcing my taste buds to become calloused to that nastiness. It is as you say, "sucktacular". I refuse to give in to the hipness!
Keith
Not only do we have coffee (purchased from a missionary organization in Oaxaca, Mexico - how's that for holy joe?), but we also have bagels... WITH CREAM CHEESE.
Yeah, we're cool like that... lol
I tried to read everything before I commented, in case I was repeating, but I just couldn't make it through in the end! This is one popular blog (congrats, it's worthy of it).
I suppose the issue with the coffee thing as I see it is that through a desire to be non-conformist in church anything can end up being given more glory than it ought to be. I.e. Any glory; it is all for God.
If we think coffee and cake will encourage people to see past stereotypes and give an opportunity to minister love, cool; if we allow it to be a part of our ritual and joke about the need for it (approaching idolatry and that), not cool and not a witness at all.
If God is glorified then there are loads of things that don't really matter either way as long as they are kept in perspective. Plus getting pleasure from things is His gift. It should be remarked though that showing love to neighbours and brothers in Christ comes above asserting our right to worship holistically.
Also, not causing another to sin by encouraging things that may be an issue for them though not for you (like addiction) needs to be considered.
We are not trapped by our faith but free in it. Love is the only measure you need to make God honouring choices. Sometimes small things are big and big things small. Always it depends on your heart.
We can help you get coffee into church. Maybe that's bad...but I don't think so...no hollowed out Bible coffee cups, but...you won't get caught sleeping in church either...
I'm a worship leader and let me tell you that the 9:00 service used to be a real snoozer, no matter what we did. I suggested MAKING everyone drink Coffee or Mountain Dew and eat a KK doughnut at the door to liven them up but we just serve coffee instead. It does seem to liven up the crowd!
We once had an elderly female first-timer almost turn around and walk back out again because she thought the shelves of syrups behind our cafe in the foyer were bottles of alcohol.
The cafe is open and the "free stuff" in urns are available before the service. And we take a coffee break mid-service for refills.
And we have transcended the coffee/clapping issue by utilizing the... "coffee clap". This may be the congregational equivalent of the coolness of a metro worship leader.
Starting standing with coffee in right hand...
Slapping thigh with left hand in time with clapping: +2
Raising left hand in worship: +3
Taking a sip while left hand still raised in worship: +5
Eyes closed during all of the above: Bonus +1
We used to have coffee before Bible Class in the basement but there is a sign on the doors to the sanctuary "No Food and Beverages". I am sure it is there because of the upholstery on the pews and the carpeting on the floor. After the evening service we often go down to the basement for caffeinated coffee, non-alcholic punch, sandwiches, squares and cookies.
Personally - my doctor says I am not supposed to have caffeine so I take a specially designed water bottle, that does not leak chemicals into your water, and put treated, purified espring.com water in it with a 1 gram bag of O2 Berry proformance Hydration in it for a healthy beverage that raises pH levels, increases athletic performance, raises oxygen levels and is sugarless, caffeineless, non-carbonated, non-colored with a delightfully slightly berry flavor.
Honestly, anything can become an addiction, and caffeine, when it gets to that point, is a minor (easily remedied) one... just ask anyone who's had to quit while pregnant. And, anyone who has had to quit knows that coffee is everywhere, all the time. So having as a "temptation" at a church service is not really much of an additional burden.
That said, we shouldn't really be surprised that everyday food and drink can be included in church. Church is, in it's purest form, a gathering of believers to encourage each other in their faith, worship together and gain wisdom and direction from their teachers/pastors.
Here's the real kicker: This was all accomplished by the early church over... are you ready? ...MEALS (aka: food and drink... and by drink, I mean wine). One third of that generation learned about Christ and grew in their faith with a *gasp* roll in one hand, and a drink in the other. :)
All the carpet issues, questions of reverance, etc. are the result of man adding law to the gospel we've been given. Those rules just became so common that it had been assumed that it had something to do with holiness.
So, if your relationship with Christ is open and honest, and your conscience is clear from concerns of addiction, then by all means, feel free to drink coffee. If your leadership is free from the manmade rules, then drink up in service as well! :)
Ok, so we would have coffee at my last church, and get this, we'd even go to the pub after church. There was even one starbucks in particular that you would certainly see a dozen or so of us in before service. It was the local hangout. Luckily church was in the evening, so going to the pub (with the pastor) wasn't that big of a deal.
i saw a church sign today and it said "Church perks: great coffeee, eternal life." I laughed pretty hard.
High school students are just as bad. And I didn't even taste coffee until I was in college. Now I can't seem to live without it.
We have two choices of caffeine intake in-house. One is the regular Church coffee in the big Stainless Urn. It's parked right next to the front entrance.
The second is the Starbucks alternative called Sacred Grounds.
All profits from that stand fund Youth activities. So you almost feel guilty walking in with Starbucks.
Although the custom brews are only available before Sunday School and after the Morning Service, we've never been discouraged from bringing drinks into the Worship Service.
I think having church in a multipurpose building that also serves as a fellowship room for meals and such kind of takes away the "Desecrating the Sanctuary" taboo.
Now if we'd just install cup holders on the backs of the chairs in front of us...
i pack my own java heat because, in my experience, church coffee is the worst brew on the planet. every church i've ever been to has confirmed this theory. i even prefer cowboy coffee, which you have to chew, to the weak, watery, bitter, stale, "hints of leftover urn cleaning chemicals", ugly church coffee. and since i don't have access to any mega churches with my own personal barista to deliver my custom latte mid-sermon, i guess i'll just have to make due on my own.
I am a Christian and like coffee because it allows me to help children. I started a coffee company to help homeless children.
I thought it would be an easy sell to get churches to sale it - could i be more wrong. To get a church to sale the coffee you have to meet with 7 committees that all have thier own agenda and 6 months later you can't even remember the point. And in the end they will find a reason TO NOT sale it - always worried about the polotical correct thing to do. i now rarely will meet with the church - I prep a church champion on the concept and let them do all the leg work . Amazing how frustrated they get.
Help a homeless child experience the love of God -
www.missiongrounds.com
Personally at one time I would not like the idea of drinking coffee during service. The church I grew up you would not see people doing this but I would think most Church now days having this going on.
Probably what bothers me more is in the Church I now attend they want everyone to serve in some way. (ok that isn't the part I have a problem wiht) So everything is a ministry. There is the seating ministry...the sound ministry...the greeter ministry and of course the Coffee ministry. I kind of wonder what kind of Pastor degree one needs to lead the coffee ministry.
On top of all that I have talked to people about how there church is and I hear a lot of...man we got great worship music...we can dance right in the aisle...oh we can get coffee right in the church and take it into the service. I kind of wonder why do people go to Church anymore?? To be entertained or to learn Gods word?
Once again I don't think anything is really wrong with. I just think if you take away the worship band...the coffee shop...and so on and just had powerful teaching of Gods word I believe you would not see as many people in that Church.
What would that tell you?
A couple of the elders of Hillsong Church in Sydney own Gloria Jean's.. the largest coffee franchise in Australia (i'm pretty sure it's bigger than Starbucks in Aussie) .. Needless to say there are coffee carts all over the place outside the church and in the foyer..
Danielle says:
I feel church leaders are prostituting the church body and by whom better, than Satan himself working through people, deceiving so many, and with coffee in the sanctuary dishonoring God.
The churches are doing this in remembrance to Jesus faithfully, every service. What's wrong with communion? What's wrong, was the crucifixton not good enough? Coffee doesn't replace communion, the strongholds of evil need broken.
They are literally lost and caught with their pants down, basically in a nut shell. Lost their belt of faithfulness, in a full piece suit of armor!
Wake up and smell the coffee, to grow up!
Job wept when the plant grew no more. Eusa wept over his lost inheritance. Don't comprise your faith.
Jesus spoke about the parts of the body and whom, within the body is causing others to offend God, to sin through their deception, manipulation, lack of self control, maturity, poor guidance and direction, etc.
I think, repent sinner and sin no more. Say, No thank you. Walk on by, do without.
Ask the Lord to direct you to a place of worship. Be careful of the crowd. Be assertive, firm and gentle and smile. Sit down and mind your own business. They may soon shut down shops!
I am uncomfortable and upset with the church. Of all people, stealing from God and if I were a store owner, I'd be livid.
People should be greeted entering and exiting, introduced and encouraged to getting outside their box. Be involved. Go to a local coffee place or wherever and discuss, minister, reach out to others, etc. Jesus healed on the Sabbath.
The behavior, conduct, habits are beginning to get more aggravating; inappropriate, more unacceptable, more offensive.
There's been lots of unwanted touching with approaches to shoulder massages and people are following, obeying.
I'm not comfortable.
It is infringement of rights, sexual assault, aggravated damages and vicarious liability of the employer being the church permitting this. The church needs to be confronted.
It is also loss of earnings, loss of potential earnings, court order interest rates (COI)to a store owner.
If I were a coffee store owner, a bookstore owner, one bearing treasures, I'd sue.
It may be the one thing, that re: balances the church to them getting their cross straight.
That would straighten them out, if they reject how you feel.
People need to focus on the Lord, get themselves right with God His way and not attack religious denominations. It is the same faith, Jesus Christ.
Salvation is based on obedience. Pray fervently, don't blasphemy the Holy Spirit, for it is the only unforgivable sin. The behavior of what leads up to that, is what makes it is unforgivable.
Pray for your children, your families, your community, all nations.
I pray that you repent, stand true to God and pray fervently, having peace of mind.
God will deal with the church, and if need be, He'll deal harshly. He is a just God, He is God. God will discipline, He will also destroy and there will be destruction, if need be.
God Bless
Danielle says:
Walk on by, the coffee..... it can wait
And those who wait upon the Lord shall renew their strength....
Tary, pray and seek the Lord, Focus on Him. He is a faithful God. Believe.
God Bless
Danielle says:
He's says, I'M ANGRY!!!!
Yes, Lord!
God Bless
Danielle says:
The Lord is ANGRY!!! Vengeance is Mine.
Yes, Lord
Are people in trouble.
A little late, but thanks to the great list your wife compiled for all us SCL fans out here, I'm rereading just about everything (there goes giving internet up for lent..)
It seems so very American, drinking coffee in church. I'm Dutch, and coffee is very firmly reserved for after the service, when we all gather and talk and give points to the pastor based on his sermon, clothes, and altogether hipness that Sunday. The only people you see drinking something in church are those that are coughing and trying to keep it down by drinking water. I've often thought I could benefit from coffee in church, but I haven't dared try it yet..
My church bought a Starbucks franchise for our coffee counter. The drinks are more reasonably priced (since minimal profit is sought) and our free coffee quality has increased tremendously.
Plus, we also have bare concrete floors, so spillage is not an issue.
i'm pretty sure no drinks are allowed in our sanctuary. but that didn't stop my bff from bringing red gatorade to the service. and it was totally alright...until the lid wasn't screwed on tight and he accidently knocked it over. We thought no one noticed the spill until someone in the first few rows of pews noticed a sea of red creeping toward the stage...
and i know it's been mentioned in another post, but i know some people planning to open a " HeBrews" coffee shop...
We have a coffee shop in our church...but we're not actually supposed to bring coffee into the sanctuary. This does not make sense to me.
I always do, though. You just sort of have to sneak it in (in your purse if you're a lady) or hold it down by your leg kind of hiding it from the ushers when you walk in. Most of the time they don't notice.
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